@Sirpantangelini Give me a starter definition in your words what corporatism is.
In the mean time
I'm gonna go to the Piggly Wiggly part of the IGA (Independent Grocers Association™️ ) have I sold out to the man yet?
@Sirpantangelini Does this differ greatly from identity politics?
@Sirpantangelini Can you define the smallest unit of corporatism these are some pretty large buckets.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
Everyone wants to blame the corporations, not the votards wanting safety and free shit.
Everyone wants to blame the corporations, not the votards wanting safety and free shit.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
No, it's that there is zero responsibility in voting. It's anonymous and you can always blame the other guy.
No, it's that there is zero responsibility in voting. It's anonymous and you can always blame the other guy.
@Sirpantangelini For purose of scoping when the line is crossed.
I'm a three man team running a family farm with decent acreage. I play the market build corn cribs and store grain for higher prices. When do I cross the line and become corporatism?
I'm a privately held manufacturer with footprint in Watford UK, Aurora US, and Monterrey MX. Am I corporatizing enough?
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
And like anything else, corruption is on a bell curve. Some are far more reliable than others.
But everyone is looking for a scapegoat, which is TruthBait's point. Humans cannot look in the mirror, so instead they look at the Rich, Whites, Jews, corporations, Satan, etc. and blame that.
And like anything else, corruption is on a bell curve. Some are far more reliable than others.
But everyone is looking for a scapegoat, which is TruthBait's point. Humans cannot look in the mirror, so instead they look at the Rich, Whites, Jews, corporations, Satan, etc. and blame that.
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
The other side of the scapegoat mentality is the talisman.
People want to believe in Saviors, so they find liberalism, religion, the military, money, sex, etc and figure that as long as they have that, they are good.
The other side of the scapegoat mentality is the talisman.
People want to believe in Saviors, so they find liberalism, religion, the military, money, sex, etc and figure that as long as they have that, they are good.
@Sirpantangelini OK, I wanted to see where we were going with this. I think I am getting a better picture of the problem.
I'll also need to research some history to understand some of the other models of industry before the markets came in. This will help me ask decent questions.
I have to get to doing some errands around town and such.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
"corporations as publically traded entitys allow these negative behaviors to grow"
Because the shareholders, or because they are subsidies?
The problem with capitalism/corporations is always the government policies that force rent-seeking behavior.
"corporations as publically traded entitys allow these negative behaviors to grow"
Because the shareholders, or because they are subsidies?
The problem with capitalism/corporations is always the government policies that force rent-seeking behavior.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
They only need constant growth because of the taxes. Why are you letting government and the voters off the hook here?
They only need constant growth because of the taxes. Why are you letting government and the voters off the hook here?
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
I disagree: when you have free markets, you will have shareholder-owned companies.
I disagree: when you have free markets, you will have shareholder-owned companies.
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
This was created by law as well.
Affirmative Action has been on the books since Kennedy.
This was created by law as well.
Affirmative Action has been on the books since Kennedy.
@Sirpantangelini @truthbait @scottdhansen
Corporations arose for a reason: the need to have capital.
This notion of yours seems to me on par with banning usury: at first, it sounds good, but then you realize that it is working against what markets will naturally create.
Corporations arose for a reason: the need to have capital.
This notion of yours seems to me on par with banning usury: at first, it sounds good, but then you realize that it is working against what markets will naturally create.
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
Cut taxes and regulatons and you will get what you want.
Of course, it helps to have culture.
Cut taxes and regulatons and you will get what you want.
Of course, it helps to have culture.
@Sirpantangelini @truthbait @scottdhansen \
Lunix has never won because:
1. It lacks the software support
2. Speaking of support, there is no support except "put your life on hold and do it yourself"
I grant you that Nadella MSFT is awful and Apple is a sick cult.
But there's a reason they have the position that they have.
Lunix has never won because:
1. It lacks the software support
2. Speaking of support, there is no support except "put your life on hold and do it yourself"
I grant you that Nadella MSFT is awful and Apple is a sick cult.
But there's a reason they have the position that they have.
tbf though, have you ever in your entire life called Microsoft tech support?
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@Sirpantangelini @truthbait @scottdhansen
I gotta somewhat agree, but you're letting the culprit off the hook: unions, affirmative action, taxes, progressive taxes, regulations, lawsuits.
These make jobs horrible.
Otherwise, you'd work a couple hours a day and then go home, like people used to.
I gotta somewhat agree, but you're letting the culprit off the hook: unions, affirmative action, taxes, progressive taxes, regulations, lawsuits.
These make jobs horrible.
Otherwise, you'd work a couple hours a day and then go home, like people used to.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Jobs are jails. We agree heartily there.
What is the solution?
Stop the wealth redistribution, and suddenly jobs are less onerous.
Corporations are limited-liability, which is necessary to protect people so that they can make some hard decisions.
I think if you take a moment, you will see that your disagreement is with (1) the socialization of losses like insurance, unions, affirmative action, taxes, etc and (2) the democracy of the shareholders, who have no "skin in the game" beyond wanting their stonks to go up.
Jobs are jails. We agree heartily there.
What is the solution?
Stop the wealth redistribution, and suddenly jobs are less onerous.
Corporations are limited-liability, which is necessary to protect people so that they can make some hard decisions.
I think if you take a moment, you will see that your disagreement is with (1) the socialization of losses like insurance, unions, affirmative action, taxes, etc and (2) the democracy of the shareholders, who have no "skin in the game" beyond wanting their stonks to go up.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Stocks arise as a way for people to invest in businesses without direct contracts.
Ban stocks/shareholders, and soon you will have more expensive corporations where people are simply direct investors, and they will buy and sell those positions like stocks.
These things evolved from free markets themselves.
Stocks arise as a way for people to invest in businesses without direct contracts.
Ban stocks/shareholders, and soon you will have more expensive corporations where people are simply direct investors, and they will buy and sell those positions like stocks.
These things evolved from free markets themselves.
@sj_zero @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Yes, many times. Usually from a subscription plan -or- salesperson relationship.
Keep in mind also that MSFT handles drivers, documentation, etc.
All volunteer stuff with Lunix.
Volunteers are... I've spent a lot of my life volunteering, and fuck volunteers, generally. The exceptions are beloved.
Yes, many times. Usually from a subscription plan -or- salesperson relationship.
Keep in mind also that MSFT handles drivers, documentation, etc.
All volunteer stuff with Lunix.
Volunteers are... I've spent a lot of my life volunteering, and fuck volunteers, generally. The exceptions are beloved.
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
Good points, and who is going to start a company doing something previously unknown, because if it backfires they will personally end up in the poorhouse or jail for a century?
Good points, and who is going to start a company doing something previously unknown, because if it backfires they will personally end up in the poorhouse or jail for a century?
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
IMHO Trump just solved this question on the federal level with his tariffs idea. Less paperwork, more economic stimulus.
At a local level? Property taxes are devastating because we pay for tons of stuff we do not need, like public schooling.
I would rather that cities charge a yearly citizenship fee.
IMHO Trump just solved this question on the federal level with his tariffs idea. Less paperwork, more economic stimulus.
At a local level? Property taxes are devastating because we pay for tons of stuff we do not need, like public schooling.
I would rather that cities charge a yearly citizenship fee.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Good point: remove legal protection for unions, and they naturally lose power.
Good point: remove legal protection for unions, and they naturally lose power.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
The more regulations, the more they can hide behind.
The more taxes, the more the market depends on them.
Imagine corporations with no taxes: there would be zero actual cost to local communities to eject one.
The more regulations, the more they can hide behind.
The more taxes, the more the market depends on them.
Imagine corporations with no taxes: there would be zero actual cost to local communities to eject one.
@Sirpantangelini @truthbait @scottdhansen
Upward mobility should probably be lessened anyway. The people who are moving up are incompetents, as we see from the current wrecked state of the West.
Upward mobility should probably be lessened anyway. The people who are moving up are incompetents, as we see from the current wrecked state of the West.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
People will do anything to dodge the diversity question.
It's a nice thought that people have liability for whatever they do, instead of socializing cost.
It's also mostly unenforceable and cuts out the utility of having people invest in corporations.
Culture of course restrains the speculators.
People will do anything to dodge the diversity question.
It's a nice thought that people have liability for whatever they do, instead of socializing cost.
It's also mostly unenforceable and cuts out the utility of having people invest in corporations.
Culture of course restrains the speculators.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait @sj_zero
Voluntarism is something else, I think, and it never struck me as realistic or good.
Voluntarism is something else, I think, and it never struck me as realistic or good.
@Sirpantangelini @truthbait @scottdhansen
Make it so that people cannot profit from their inventions, and you will get less of those.
Contrast Europe and the USA during the last century.
Make it so that people cannot profit from their inventions, and you will get less of those.
Contrast Europe and the USA during the last century.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
I agree on repealing the 17th, but so far, I have seen zero reason not to repeal everything past the Bill of Rights.
I agree on repealing the 17th, but so far, I have seen zero reason not to repeal everything past the Bill of Rights.
@truthbait @scottdhansen @Sirpantangelini
It's a good point and you are talking classic supply-side economics there: put the money back into production as part of a cycle, and you get more production, instead of relying on speculation to drive the economy (which is what Sir Pantangelini is talking about in his rant about corpos, most likely).
It's a good point and you are talking classic supply-side economics there: put the money back into production as part of a cycle, and you get more production, instead of relying on speculation to drive the economy (which is what Sir Pantangelini is talking about in his rant about corpos, most likely).
@Sirpantangelini @truthbait @scottdhansen
It's an interesting idea. I think this would apply most in court cases about IP law, i.e. instead of regular damages, you just charge a licensing fee and legal costs.
It's an interesting idea. I think this would apply most in court cases about IP law, i.e. instead of regular damages, you just charge a licensing fee and legal costs.
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
Without going that far, I think it might discourage inovation because people will find it hard to profit from their ideas when a larger firm swoops in, gets the compulsory licenses, and sells it more cheaply.
Economies of scale are great but can work against us.
Without going that far, I think it might discourage inovation because people will find it hard to profit from their ideas when a larger firm swoops in, gets the compulsory licenses, and sells it more cheaply.
Economies of scale are great but can work against us.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
I think the point is start-up funding.
Say I invent a new type of nuclear reactor; it will take a billion dollars to get it going.
I need a way to raise that, and selling stock/futures is the best way anyone knows of so far.
I think the point is start-up funding.
Say I invent a new type of nuclear reactor; it will take a billion dollars to get it going.
I need a way to raise that, and selling stock/futures is the best way anyone knows of so far.
@truthbait @scottdhansen @Sirpantangelini
Interesting. I didn't know this but I know very little of entertainment law, and am very skeptical of most of the rock song court cases for the same reason that the "Stairway" case was decided: arguably rock is so simple that unless you clone the vocal melody or the song entirely, all these cases should be thrown out.
HOWEVER (big point is) I think a lot of law is going in this direction simply because damages can be so wild, and those costs get passed on to the consumer. Lawyers generally know little of economics but that is changing.
Interesting. I didn't know this but I know very little of entertainment law, and am very skeptical of most of the rock song court cases for the same reason that the "Stairway" case was decided: arguably rock is so simple that unless you clone the vocal melody or the song entirely, all these cases should be thrown out.
HOWEVER (big point is) I think a lot of law is going in this direction simply because damages can be so wild, and those costs get passed on to the consumer. Lawyers generally know little of economics but that is changing.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
I agree there: Google buying companies to kill them is not a good thing.
However, short of having an antitrust judge look over the process, there's no real solution.
I agree there: Google buying companies to kill them is not a good thing.
However, short of having an antitrust judge look over the process, there's no real solution.
@truthbait @Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen
My solution here is to stop using lawyers on crap cases, and to focus on actual damages to consumers.
Right now only antitrust law and class action suits deal with damages to consumers as a group. These are sub-optimal (LOL).
My solution here is to stop using lawyers on crap cases, and to focus on actual damages to consumers.
Right now only antitrust law and class action suits deal with damages to consumers as a group. These are sub-optimal (LOL).
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Big point here is "new type of nuclear reactor" that needs funding.
I think you have added another issue here which relates to regulation of utilities.
Big point here is "new type of nuclear reactor" that needs funding.
I think you have added another issue here which relates to regulation of utilities.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Arguably, we needed Google to exist. For a few years, they provided something that no one else could.
It turned out to be based on bullshit -- PageRank -- but now no one can compete with their indexing and engineer corps.
Arguably, we needed Google to exist. For a few years, they provided something that no one else could.
It turned out to be based on bullshit -- PageRank -- but now no one can compete with their indexing and engineer corps.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
It's an interesting question. I favor minimal government involvement, but utilities evolved to be exclusive for a reason.
It's an interesting question. I favor minimal government involvement, but utilities evolved to be exclusive for a reason.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Exams world? What did I miss?
I wish we had stuck with AltaVista, but I think there were going to be problems at scale.
Exams world? What did I miss?
I wish we had stuck with AltaVista, but I think there were going to be problems at scale.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Now THAT'S a flashback.
Holy shit the acid I took in high school just kicked in.
Now THAT'S a flashback.
Holy shit the acid I took in high school just kicked in.
@amerika @scottdhansen @truthbait
To note.
Part of my extreme stance is the understanding that the world is in turmoil, and a unified foe is the best option for this.
Corporations being this foil is the healthiest/most functional option.
Specifically it supplies commies with an offramp that doesn't wholly include capitalism, only a plugin for capitalism.
@Sirpantangelini @scottdhansen @truthbait
Egalitarianism/individualism/narcissism is the enemy.
It's not tangible but it's a pathology.
Egalitarianism/individualism/narcissism is the enemy.
It's not tangible but it's a pathology.