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I'm just old enough to get the reference @denisbloodnok's username is making : P

@strypey Im not old enough but I adored falling into that world when I was a teenager.

If it wasnt for a genuine interest in the Goons and cocktail music I doubt my father in law would be quite so tolerant of me @denisbloodnok

@indieterminacy
> Im not old enough but I adored falling into that world when I was a teenager

Me too, I'm not *that* old : P But I did listen to the Goons on cassette tapes and replays on broadcast radio, so that's already getting towards old ...

@denisbloodnok

@strypey I bump into random comedy records - some I fence to him when he knows them.

I keep putting off a deep dive into Round The Horne, which is a shame at the quality of bawdiness is stellar.

Ive got a nice idea in my head of a Hacker Radio talk on cybernetics that would be Goon acerbic. No time to develop that any time soon, probably should sketch it out before its too late.

@denisbloodnok

@indieterminacy
> I bump into random comedy records - some I fence to him when he knows them.

My Dad is a big fan of 2 US comics called Wayne and Shuster. All through childhood he'd regale us with his impressively memorised renditions of Rinse the Blood Off My Toga and Frontier Psychiatrist. In my late teens I found a copy of the record in a charity shop, and gave it to him as a Christmas present. Good times.

@strypey There must have been more of those copies floating around NZ and Austrialia.

You have resolved to me the riddle of which charity disc the Avalanches used for this famous song:
https://redirect.invidious.io/watch?v=qLrnkK2YEcE

Fortunately they didnt pick up a Harry Seycombe record (those are awful, glad I was never naive enough)

@indieterminacy
> which charity disc the Avalanches used for this famous song

Love that track, and the video. Pure Dada. Great fun.

@indieterminacy @strypey I am not young, but it was my parents who introduced me to the Goons. ;-)

@denisbloodnok
> it was my parents who introduced me to the Goons

Not sure exactly how I first stumbled into Goonery. But I remember my Dad introducing me to Monty Python. I distinctly remember him saying, as a replay of the Flying Circus started on NZ TV; 'this will appeal to your twisted sense of humour'.

He was quite right. I was instantly hooked, and sought out anything Python-adjacent for years afterwards. Life of Brian remains one of my all-time favourite comedies.

@indieterminacy

@strypey Now Spike Millighan was often a horrid man. In Q Music magazine was him interviewing Van Morrison. Supposedly its legendary as its this intersection between surealism and cruelty - VM must have been in shock after the mauling, it sounds intense. @denisbloodnok

@indieterminacy
> Now Spike Millighan was often a horrid man. In Q Music magazine was him interviewing Van Morrison

First I've heard of it. Are you sure you're not confusing Q Magazine with the Milligan's TV show Q? Maybe there was a writer at Q who had a similar name.

@denisbloodnok

@indieterminacy I finally got around to reading Spike's interview with VM;

https://www.pauldunoyer.com/van-morrison-spike-milligan-interview/

Can't see anything horrid, any cruelty, nor any sign of a mauling. Was this a joke that went over my head, or ... ?

@denisbloodnok

@strypey @denisbloodnok
As somebody who can be a bit full on I read they were operating on different levels and VM was not ready for SM being acerbic and pugnacious and could imagine VM's "unconcealed hostility".

I trust the reporter's opinion "I would hate to be back in that rural living room now".

I remember Irish jokes growing up (the Brits eventually dropped them) and know rhythm of relatives. To make that many Irish comments to a Belfast musician in 89 is like pulling at a cats whiskers.

@indieterminacy
> To make that many Irish comments to a Belfast musician in 89 is like pulling at a cats whiskers

You do know Spike is Irish too, right? He says so in the article.

@denisbloodnok

@strypey I was in a pub for a Christmas with mine and my extended family near Hyde Park (West London).

The young pub staff member was serving us a group with the matrix of Irish and English (born and migrated).

Those types of Irish jokes dropped off the map years back but not in this plummy enclave.

I had to explain to my English sister in law the low level "humour" the silly man made serving her, (her accent has migrated).

I guess this type of arrogance still resides.

hohum

@strypey I recall reading once that SM only got an Irish passport as his colonialist pride as he didnt want to be queing up with lots of coloured people as part of the procedure to secure his British passport.

Im mature enough to separate his work as an artist and writer and Ive also read that he could also be kind. But he was also a horrid person who could be needlessly cruel.

@denisbloodnok

(1/?)

@indieterminacy
> SM only got an Irish passport as his colonialist pride as he didnt want to be queing up with lots of coloured people as part of the procedure to secure his British passport.

That would be completely out of character. At least that's what I get from the extensive reading I did about him as a teenager after I first got obsessed with the Goons.

@denisbloodnok

(2/3)

Spike, as I said, understood himself as Irish, not "British". His writing shows a strong sense of solidarity with other peoples subjugated by the English, as were his own. Remember Ireland only got (part of) its independence during Spike's adult life. As you implied in your comment about '89, conflict continued in Northern Ireland until the Good Friday Agreement, and tensions only started to ease over the last decade or so of Spike's life.

(3/3)

The idea of Spike Milligan aligning himself with English colonialism is as baffling as the idea of Eric Idle aligning himself with US republicanism. Although a joke referencing that sort of ludicrous juxtaposition would be right in Spike's wheelhouse. Maybe that's been misinterpreted as a serious statement somewhere along the way?

@strypey Its worth noting that SM's taste for the Chieftains marks him down as a connoisseur of Irish folk music.

Im sure his interest and love of Ireland is genuine.

... I am just not convinced that VM was appreciating the questioning.
This happens in life, merely somebody was there to document it.

(1/2)

@indieterminacy
> I am just not convinced that VM was appreciating the questioning

You may be reading a late 20thC text through an early 21stC lens. The Q journalist says Van specifically requested Spike interview him, and that he was laughing throughout. Van says he's uncomfortable in general with interviews and especially with talking about his personal life. But I read his responses as finding Spike's rambling conversational style relaxing.

(2/2)

I grew up a descendant of the Scots Diaspora in a British colony, saturated in British traditions and media (especially TV shows), but identifying more with the indigenous people than the colonial regime. Perhaps this gives me an inside perspective on a conversation between 2 Irishmen that's hard to appreciate for someone from mainland Europe?

@sj_zero
Well, you've exposed my complete lack of opportunity to learn my ancestral tongue, for reasons explained here;

https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115740350570021043

I could try to get a machine to translate this. Or you could just tell me in English what it says (or Te Reo Māori which I do have basic fluency in).

@sj_zero
> The Irish and Scottish are examples of colonialism which most people don't think of

Uh-huh. Preaching to the choir mate. See the post linked in the post you replied to.

> I figured using three languages of colonized people which the English did their best to suppress was poetic

💯%. But I still don't know what you said. If it's not important that I know, kei te pai.